Podcast Transcript
hi my name is Jeff from Mental Health Resource and I am Kay Lauren a guest host here today and today we have our
guest Joe Tac hi hi how you doing I’m doing all
right how are you pretty good good yeah so Joe is has 16 years in recovery um he
works with Wounded Warrior Project and rock to recovery and also um is an avid
musician and plays in a couple bands so tell us a little bit B about yourself um yeah I uh I’m a drug addict
and a convict and ex-convict and um uh I would consider I’m recovered um
but and still an active recovery and uh I um I do work for uh an organization
called Rock recovery um and uh we spefic specifically it’s actually with Air
Force Wounded Warriors we’ve had a defense contract with them for nine years and then um rock recovery is
essentially I’m a music therapist of THS and we work with mental health facilities um drug and alcohol treatment
centers along with the Wounded Warriors um and
basically we bring a bunch of instruments in and we generally write and record and mix and uh upload a song
with people that may or may have not ever played music before and use it as um you know
uh active way of of have being able to release your emotions and for me I you
know most musicians are are kind of spoiled we have some sort of release
that we can Channel our anger or sadness or our love or whatever it is into and
um a lot of people don’t get to have that experience so it stays trapped inside them yeah yeah it’s like an
outlet it is it’s a it’s a huge outlet and um you know I I never in my recovery
journey I never got to go to rehab like I always detox in a jail cell or a prison cell or um you know uh but a lot
of the treatment centers these days um my buddy and founder of rock to Recovery
West went through treatment and he noticed that there was no music but people are you know painting
and taking photos and making vision boards and painting rocks and doing sound bowls and doing things but he’s
like you know the only time I ever feel good is when I’m playing music so he he you know it’s grown over the years on on
on our the way we do things but um it used to start where we would do it like
over a month but the turnover rate and treatment centers were kind of high so
we would uh we just took it down to where we actually do it within an hour hour and a half to two hours we write record a song from scratch so so when
did you start playing music oh and I guess how right cuz usually it’s like somebody kind of like
pushes the person into it yeah well my mother was a musician so um what’ she play she played
piano and keys in like a classic rock style like Kansas Journey Boston typ
manand cool and um so from as young as I can remember you know I would be in studios or the garage while they were
playing uh my grandmother also played piano too in church but um my mom won
awards and played for the president and got little signs like my mom was really
really good at uh so but yeah I kind of grew up doing that and going with her to the Sunset Strip and watching her play
at the whiskey and the Roxy and doing all those things so it was always kind of in my blood from from day one so what
instrument did you play or a bunch yeah I started with piano piano and
uh from then on I think at 8 I got my first guitar but I wanted
to be a drummer so I started I got my first drum set at 10: and then I picked
uh I tried to do that for about three to four years and then um I picked up guitar around
14 um and from there um and then I kind of
started doing some vocals and singing and doing stuff like that so I I um I’m known more like with my bands
and in the professional like in the music industry for being a guitar player in a backup vocalist but i’ I just got
done playing bass in a band last night so it’s just I kind of well-rounded as far I’m I’m a jack of Jack of all
instruments jack of all trades but master of none like I can’t read a lick of music but um I I can find my way
around usually say you mastered the guitar pretty well well thank you I’ve had the Delight of hearing you play so
yeah we’ve got to work together yeah which has been a pleasure when did the uh the drug abuse start
oh and I guess like kind of like how cuz I mean I know like they’re kind of uh associated with one another in a sense
right like being a rock star right like drugs and alcohol yeah you know um my
mom was very active in addiction M um so
over the time she had me very young and then uh but as we were we were growing up my mom you know drank a
lot um she didn’t drink too much I mean she kind of kept it together for a while but she was a very active cocaine
user um and I was raised by my grandparents mostly my grand it was very
religious household my grandpa was a a principal my mom or my grandmother was a
teacher so like education and sports and all that kind of stuff was very active
when I was doing that during school so I would live with them part-time and then during the summer I’d go stay with Mom and mom was like the partyer Rockstar
girl you know my mom had me when she was 16 or 17 oh wow so she was still you
know in her you know figuring stuff out figuring some stuff out you know and uh
I remember like round junior high was was
the time I started like drinking and smoking weed and everybody wanted to be
like you know that’s when I kind of was like I want to live with Mom more than I want to live with my grandparents rules
and my mom was like the cool Mom where you can come over and pop some Zas and some wine coolers as long as you stay
here you know you know if you smoke a joint we won’t tell anybody but you got to stay here and you got share it with
her yeah well yeah that too you know but um zemas and wine cools I’m dating
myself you are yeah for sure um but then
uh I I would remember because I would always go over to my aunt’s house and my
and and I have a whole like Mexican side of my family with with my stepdad but I’d always go over to my
aunt’s house and my mom would always send me up hey go get some tacos from Aunt Francis but when I went and got you know went and picked up the tacos there
was always like a nice little clavo or something inside of it so I always knew what was happening like I’d be picking
up stuff for my mom and I always promised myself like hey I’m never going to be like that you know and then when I
started Living with Mom she wasn’t used to making lunches and making sure I got up for school it’d be like me making her
up like hey I need a lunch I’m going to school you know what I mean and she’d just be like out of it you know
um going into high school
um freshman year I started partying a little bit my sophomore year um the
summer going from my freshman year and a sophomore year into high school um I was already in um chamber
singers I was playing varsity baseball um I was also uh very active you know
with music um but that summer um I got
uh I had my first taste of methamphetamine oh man going into high school going into my sophomore year oh
going into sophomore year wow and and I had my cousins with the Mexican side of my family that we would you know we were
we were hanging out a lot that summer it used to be really cool to go to Disneyland and we in notb form they used
to have like Studio K and we would hang out and go dance and and meet girls and do all those things but uh they were
already getting into the family business if you know what I’m saying so um my sophomore year I go in and instantly
when I did my first line of math I fell in love like it was it was like love at first sight and then musically it made
me hyperfocused I could put on any album that I wanted to and I could go to guitar and I’d learn every song front to
back on guitar and then I’d go to drums and I learn it front to back on drums bass Keys singing and do whatever and
then I’d move on so I thought you know I was like some it helped you yeah musically at least yeah I mean in the
beginning yeah it was good till it wasn’t yeah it was good till it wasn’t I mean it was great in the beginning like it it took me you know I went miles with
that but um so it was my Bright Idea sophomore year to drop out of school and
sell drugs and play music the rest of my life okay so it kind of took off from there um and then meth
basically was was I was a slave to meth for a long time after
that do you think there’s a connection between like musicians in addiction and mental health issues you think they’re
intertwined yeah I mean absolutely yeah I mean most I mean every good singer in a band’s got a screw loose you know what
I’m saying um every uh you know I mean we’re all
struggling and and like I kind of said in the beginning with rock to recovery it’s like a lot of people like musicians
are I I’ve I’ve come to believe that we’re a little bit spoiled that we have some sort of Outlet
because there’s a lot of stuff going on up in here you know and especially with people that are active in alcohol and
addiction but um I’ve always had a place where I can pour
that into some people find it with poetry some people find it with painting some people find it with with some sort
of creative outlet but some people don’t have any sort of creative Outlet at all whatsoever but I you know most of my
Rockstar friends and people that are doing big things in the music industry are either in recovery or have have
dabbled with it or found their ways out of it one way or the other but I think there’s a huge connection with anybody
that’s extremely creative with alcohol and addiction for sure I think it has to do with the sensitivity
to pain like it allows you to feel um on a degree that maybe a little bit too
much and I think that’s why you’re able to create in that way but you also want to numb that because it’s super intense
for sure take us to you know after high school you’re already
kind of deep in meth and fenom use how did you end up in prison Okay so
there’s a bunch of ways I ended up yeah okay um start from the top yeah um my best friend was like a who’s
now like a fifth generation locksmith right um I start running in selling dope
with um selling speed math heroin whatever I could you know what anybody wanted and um I had a knock knack for
for stealing cars and I had a whole family and I was at where I would start
uh I was uh taking cars down to
Mexico and selling them um I was I got ended up busted with me and two other
people for theft ring in Orange County did you end up just walking back over
the Border after you dropped the yeah okay I I I i’ I’d pay a couple people like hey here’s an eightball drive this
down south with me and it was a lot easier back then you know so you just drive over the Border I go I drop the
cars off I pick up some money you know what I mean and I’d come back and walk back across we get on the Am track and
come home and um you know I get paid anywhere from 5 to six 7,000 per car so i’ try to
go down there with two to three at a time and then uh we had chop shops back in the day and I’m dating myself again
but like this the the VTEC Motors were a big thing and everybody was putting them in these crxs and making them into race
cars and you know um so I ended up getting busted with my brother and two
other people and uh at at with the tow yard which was our chop shop for 167
stolen cars and 87 stolen motorcycles that’s what I got busted for right but um I was a little
white boy in Orange County so it’s like I I would I would I kept my circle very small where I was taking everything I
wasn’t very smart about it and um like anytime I was getting into LA County I was like nah I’m going to turn around
and come back you know cuz I didn’t want to get busted La um so that was the first time I got busted and then from
there um you know uh basically from the time that I was
17 until I was
24 um I wasn’t out of jail or prison for
longer than like 90 days four months tops so it would be a vicious cycle when
I was um also kind of like my mom I ended up having a kid with somebody and
um and she you know I got I got arrested I got out five months later and she was
with somebody else and um I handled things terribly you know I mean looking
back at it but I would always use that as an excuse I don’t want to go see my kid I wouldn’t I’d get some sort of
conflict I’d get the fuckets I’d go out I get high and I turn it into a vicious cycle of of me just getting busted in
revolving door which turned into you know six months in jail in probation to 9 months to a year to 16 months to two
years to three years in prison year violations in Chino State Prison you know I’ve done all it was all that time
I would stay like in and out of that well once you’re in it it’s kind of a revolving door right like you’re just
it’s so hard to get out of the clenches of that system yeah and I mean it’s like it I you know I like one of my you think
what the bottom was but the guy that I got busted with with um with all the stolen
cars um we were already I was out on bail I was you know um I moved him into
my mother’s house in an RV let him cook meth out in front of my RV for about
three months I was trying to be sober at the time and I got my first job at a moving company and I started doing long
haul moves and was trying to do the right thing and he was supposed to help pay rent and help pay for things while I was there and we were supposed to be on
the straight and narrow but he was still going to be cooking and um he ends up
burning me while I’m on a long haul with with a move and I come back and the gas is shut off the water’s turned off you
know and uh um my mom and my dad and my grandparents are like what are we doing
like it it’s like over $1,000 dollar to get all these bills turned back on and I’m the oldest of six kids my mom was
busy I’m the oldest of six kids right and uh so I I call a dude I find out and I
call some of the homies and I find out where he’s out and I go over to to get money from him and he ends up being
knotted out you know trying to talk to me I’m like hey dude you got to turn these Bill like you screwed me over you
know so and he wouldn’t do it and he nodded out I took half his money I took half his dope and I came back I paid the
bills I did everything that was supposed to be done you know and then I started getting high two months later
um he I I can’t get any more dope and um he’s the only person in town that’s got it and I call him up and say ask him if
he needs anything he’s like yeah get me a 4Runner so I get him a 4Runner I bring him over there I said you know I just
made things right because of what you said you know yeah dude we’re good we’re good we’re good right and
um so long story short you know we’re sitting there talking the next thing you
know I’m I’m I get blacked out and I had three different dudes came
in behind me and [ __ ] pistol with me from behind and duck tap me to a chair and he
played Russian roulette with me for like two and a half hours while they pistol wh me um when I was in and out of
Consciousness the whole time and I was like I remember waking up it was off uh Western in catella in Orange County
across the street from Motel 6 and I wake up and I think I’m dead and I’m looking up and I see the moon and I see
the stars and I’m like swinging I’m like oh am I dead you know and uh I was like that gun went off
you know and um I land out in the middle of the street and I hear like a big horn
and I roll over and I see like these big rig tires flying past me like within front of my face and they took my money
my pager that dates me too uh his car my gun all the things and
um uh I walk over the only thing I could do is uh walk over to the gas station and
there was a pay phone there and I didn’t have anything on me and I walk up to the mirror at the motel or uh Circle K and I
could see the glass the reflection of me in the glass I’m wearing like a wife beater probably like a 100 pounds some
Dickies and I’m just covered in blood like from head to toe I look like Carrie from the movie
Carrie and um I walk in and the guy’s like dude I’m calling the cops I’m like do not call the cops
right just let me use your phone I need to call some people and I
call um everybody I know it’s like 4 o’clock in the morning nobody’s answering and uh he just reaches in the
drawer and he gives me a roll of quarters he’s like dude just get out of here and I went out to the pay phone the
only person I picked up was my grandmother and uh she comes and picks me up she wants to take me to the
hospital and uh she doesn’t I end up going to my buddy house and they sewed
me up and I got a bunch of scars from that situation but that was kind of like the bottoms that that was the kind of
Life I Lived you know and there was a bunch of PE you know people on the news and people ending up in trash cans and
bunch of gangs and prison gangs and stuff that I was all like in the middle of getting involved in but that was that
all the way up until I was about 24 years old but two numbers a bunch of
prison time yeah from that was was that the bottom that made you no you you that wasn’t it
for you yeah take us on that Journey um I did I I mean that was that
was just like kind of like my day-to-day life like I had a lot of that stuff going on for a long time like if if it
wasn’t like that then it wasn’t you know that’s just kind of how I lived my life for a long long time and
um my bottom the first
time was in 2001 and I was finishing a three-year
term at Chino state prison um and I was they were going to
parole me to a halfway house in Garden Grove it was called Josephine the Josephine house and that’s the first
place that I ever got a taste of AA but um I was on that yard it was two
weeks before I I was supposed to leave to go to the Josephine house it’s when 911
happened um we end up being locked down everybody thought we were under attack and everybody tried to take over the
prison so I ended up being there for two weeks longer than I was supposed to and then finally went to Josephine
Street um I paroled from there I tried to drink like a gentleman for a little bit and moved in with my friend Erica in
South County I started drinking we ended up at a bar one night singing karaoke
having a good time and doing whatever but I was going to be the driver because everybody else was trash so it was my
best thinking that I was like oh I got to sober up I’m in Garden Grove I’ll call one of the
homies I’ll smoke a little speed just so I can get us home you know because I’m pretty drug makes sense
yeah so from that point on it was probably three months into that that I
screwed off my job and did everything else as soon as I started doing speed again and um I was three dirty tests
with parole and um I was with this girl at the time and I was like I can’t do this
anymore I’m going to go I mean I’m on my way back to my another violation like I
can’t do this anymore and I called Erica her dad owned some recovery homes in
Fullerton and um I called him up Mike Fran and I said
hey um at Josephine Street every Sunday I would have to do these AA panels they
would come in and talk and I would listen and I thought it was crazy I thought it was a cult and I thought it was you know and I was bummed because
that was visiting time that’s when the girls can come you know and do stuff but I got to go sit in this freaking meeting
right now but I knew he did AA and I knew he’d been sober for a long time and I was
like I don’t know how to do this like he’s like well if you can test clean you can come I’ll give you a bet at my house
I’ll give you a month to figure stuff out and get a job and do your things you got to do 30 meetings in 30 days so I
detoxed on my brother’s couch for two days um I went to the sober living home
got put in I called my parole officer and I was like like hey um I know it’s been a month you know um
but this is where I’m at and this is what I’m trying to do um I know I’ve been [ __ ] up and he’s like I’ll be
there first thing in the morning 700 a.m. and you better be there I was like all
right and I for the first time that night I hit my knees and it wasn’t like the back of the cop car please get me
out of the situation type prayer was just like hey God if you can give me a solid
chance at trying something different you know um I’m going to definitely
change my ways I know we haven’t talked in a while but I could use some solid help right now and my parole officer
came over the next morning and he basically told me by himself I I thought they were going to
take me in and you said hey here’s a cup um you have three dirty tests I’m
I’m supposed to take you in right now and I’m here by myself I’m not taking you in but if this test is dirty then
put your running shoes on because there’s nothing I can do for you he’s like are you clean I’m like I hope
so and I pissed in that cup and I prayed again that night I I was smoking probably an eightball a day at that
point and I only had two days of sleep before my brother kicked me out so there’s no really real reason why that test should
have came back clean and I don’t know if like my parole officer turned it in at
all I don’t know if God came down sprinkled M Magic magic fairy dust all over my PE or whatever the deal is but
the test came back clean and I did 30 meetings in 30 days and that was kind of like my first
bottom um there’s a place called a meeting place in Fullerton I go to that
daily started working with my dad um and uh there was a musician that came
at a speaker meeting there and um it’s probably like 28 days into it and uh I
remember hearing his story and I could relate with a lot and it was an AA meeting but he said uh he just enjoyed
AA more and that he was a drug addict but he think said he found more recovery in
that so I went to him and I asked him to sponsor me and
um yeah I after that I I I ended up working all my steps with him I ended up
meeting the mother and my daughter about 30 days later you quick yeah and uh 90 days into
it we kind of made a packed with each other that we were going to finish our steps she was in a program at the time
um and uh we ended up getting married and having a kid and doing stuff and I ended up staying clean and sober for
about five years so that was kind of my bottom the first time around what happened that made you
relapse after five years of recovery um like they say in the book
like I stopped I got all the gifts from the program like I got all the promises that they say at every meeting right you
know uh you will not regret the past or wish to shut the door on it you know um
I we just like life got Lifey I ended up getting a really really good job I ended
up getting into you know I was doing a started playing actually professionally
with music for the first time got in my first band that led to another band that led to another band that ended up
getting me a record deal and um getting looked at by major labels and and
hanging out with all the people in the music business that I used to just dream about working with and
um uh I was making over triple digits working seven days on seven days off in
the oil fields playing and going on tour with great bands and
uh about five years into it we just kind of figured that we were cured together
that we were just drug addicts we weren’t really alcoholics I never
got I never went to prison or caught a number or kicked in any doors or stole any cars from you know drinking a couple
beers and taking a couple shots and that we’ve were cured so we went out on our
anniversary and my manager at the time for the band um got us a couple bottles
of crystal we went out and had a good weekend for our anniversary we went out and drank together so that was that was
the relapse portion of it and how long was it before you picked up again because that liquor always leads you
right back to the bag doesn’t it um it took a minute for the bag but um within
us starting to drink and saying that we were just going to drink together or we would drink on the weekends or do
whatever um three months into it my band was kind of taking off
and uh the the drinking Together part stopped like she would drink when she was with people and I would drink after
shows and I would drink if I was out mingling or doing whatever and um so three months into that it came down to
the situation whether it was the band or my my family and I chose the band over
my family so it was like okay well if you’re not going to support my dreams I’ve come far to try to do this like I
think you should be supporting me with it I don’t want you going anywhere but I went to a show one night came home
and she was packed up and went took my kid everything was gone you know um six
months into it um my band broke up um at that point I ended up doing
cocaine in between the after she left because it was organic Yeah Yeah from
the ground yeah from a plant it’s from a plant yeah it’s natural the Lord made it yeah it’s like the Whole Foods
ofs yeah um um and it was more acceptable like you know what I mean uh
socially you know um and I remember the first time I did that and it was uh uh I
was in Hollywood I was at the rainbow room with a bunch of people that are
actually sober now that are pretty big names in the business but we were all wasted and um I went upstairs into the
bathroom and there’s a couple girls in there doing some coke and I they asked me if I wanted a line I’m like no it was
after after a show one night when I went to the bathroom I go to wash my hands they’re like hey you want a line I’m
like no I’m good thanks you know and then they’re like hey you want a line
and put it out there I was like absolutely want a line and from that point on I was doing
coke pretty much every weekend the devil was working hard MH nine months seven to eight months
into that um my wife or ex-wife um was dating
some uh deplorable guy um that ended up beating
her up and putting hands on my kid and said that he was going to shoot me in the back and a bunch of stuff
happened she called me in the middle of the night freaking out and uh this was
like on a Sunday and I’ve been doing coke since Thursday so um you know my
atct brain was like okay I need to call some of the fellas I come back down to Anaheim Orange County I go and pick up
go pick up a gun I’ve been doing coke all weekend I haven’t slept so I need to stay up this dude’s going to [ __ ]
come after me I need to handle business so I end up smoking some speed three months after that I’m crime Bell crime
Bell crime looking at 13 years in prison again so that’s how quick that happened it was like all within a year from 2007
to 2008 okay you’re looking at 13 years but
you didn’t do the 13 years years mm so April 20th of 2008 I’m right up the
street from here off daring the 55 freeway the Motel 6 and um I had
everything a good alcoholic and drug addict likes had a bunch of speed bunch of weed bottle of greay goose in the
fridge beautiful GR in bed with me all the adult activities on TV you know and
I was miserable mhm and like I was just looked back at my life from what I’ve
done in the year I’m already out on two Bales and
um uh I called uh a friend of mine that ran
Wood Glen at the time and asked him for a couple beds for me and my girl and uh I called some of a friends
of mine and said hey just come pick up all this stuff for me try to sell it for whatever you can and just give it to me so I can fight these
cases and they came at like 2 o’clock in the morning picked it up 5:30 in the
morning I had three different task force kick in my door before I could put I kept one pipe load to go to detox with
and they took me into jail before that so that’s my sobriety date right now is April 21st of
2008 and we fought the cases down I went from 13 to three years I ended up doing three years and Jayla got out on uh
1116 of 2011 and been sober ever since
yeah what was different this time when you got
out um I had a I already had a head full of
AA okay and
um the steps had done its work in my life and I had a higher power in my life and I had uh what my understanding of it
was and I was already
done before I had to go back to prison you know so it was easy to stay clean in
prison it’s always easier for me to stay clean when I’m locked up even though it’s all there anyway but um when I got
out I just kind of jumped into AA autopilot you know um I knew I had work to do I had a lot of you know I had DUIs
and classes and you know child support and thing all those things you got to
get but I would just go to a morning meeting and try to find a job and leave come back for a noon meeting try to find
a job come back try to find some people to work out with I call my buddy that’s a drummer in a band that I loved and
respected and we we toured together when we were sober and he also saw me when I was relapsed but I asked him to sponsor
me and and started doing the steps and and doing my thing but I I I was just
any any uh reservations that I thought that I wasn’t an alcoholic and that I was just a drug addict it was was
already smashed you know so that was I think is what what changed I did the
experimenting after having everything and literally giving it back and then
you know I think that’s what changed for me this time a little
bit Yeah is there any uh musical like I know like I don’t know what you’d call
it is there any like musical Outlet within the correctional the correctional
system there is and it just it depends on what facility you’re at right so I ended up actually I had some nylon
string acoustic guitar for my last term that I ended up being able to get my
hands on um and I wouldn’t give back and I got some strings you know and I knew
some I knew that I knew the the co and I knew the person working in the library I’m like yeah this this I’m not
returning this like okay that’s cool you know and um so and I ended up writing
some like some of the heaviest songs I’ve ever written I wrote on that guitar on for my metal band uh or my first band
that I got out but um and I would just play with that but there was there’s no like band room and there’s no I mean you
know not in any of the facilities that I’ve been at no directed focused programs no not in prison do you think
that that’d be something that could be helpful 100% yeah has rock to recovery
considered doing things in Correctional Facilities um you know that’s something
I I would probably want to talk to Wes about but it’s been a kind of a journey for for him to do this and you know he’s
just like us so I mean he’s just like me you know he’s a he’s a drug addict and alcoholic and
um uh he ended up getting a job to play guitar and Korn for eight years I think
it was and um when he ended up losing that job with Korn that’s what he’s like
I don’t know what I’m going to do with my life I know I’m I’m sober um I know I want to help people
and the only thing I really know how to do is play music you know um so he kind
of started it with that and he wanted to help you know um soldiers and Veterans and and people
in mental health and and stuff so it kind of progressed over time to where it was just him and it’s still kind of
growing and it’s kind of become its own thing because it went went from just him to now there’s 17 going to be 20 of us
across the United States that that facilitate it and we are getting into to um like to where we’ve we’ve worked
with over 150 treatment centers we’ve written over 30,000 songs with people um
you know just me alone I’ve been with them for three years and I think I I I just broke 12 12 or 1300 songs I’ve
written personally so um and we are progressing to where Rock recovery’s
become such a staple with the treatment and the mental health side of facilities and and people kind of know who who we
are and what we’re doing um we’re kind of branching out to where we’re getting to another part of um of the company which we’re going
to we’re basically going to call it Ban Jam and it’s going to still address the mental health portion of it but try to
hit it early you know and and take it out to a broader spectrum of people which might be Correctional Facilities
as well at risk youth or something like that yeah sure um but you know we’re
going to even in a corporate environment like a lot of people do the day-to-day in andout grind they don’t see any of
their co-workers they talking to everybody on Zoom they don’t have any kind of physical interaction any kind of
team creating something together it’s just that you know here’s the tpz report
I’m sending it out to you okay Karen you know what I mean so it’s like you know it’s getting in with them and getting
them all together and maybe you know getting that mental
health positive and and hitting it earlier than before you’re out some sort
of bottom you know but I mean you know maybe that could be something in the correctional facilities too I mean I I I
I think that’s a great idea yeah for the person that’s watching this and has had
some of your same experiences what is just absolutely hopeless and cannot seem to figure it out what would you have to
say to them
um I mean there’s a there’s a better way of life you know
um we’ve all been hopeless and at the bottom
um and if it wasn’t you know for me it was pretty simple it was it was 12 steps
and having something greater than myself to help restor me to sanity that helped me get here you know and
um it’s uh sometimes it’s just dropping some of the pride that you have or you
know um a lot I think that my pride is what helded me back from it a long time
was that I wasn’t a man if I had to ask somebody else for help or um you know and you that goes for men
and women you know I mean it’s like can you still be a strong independent woman and need help yeah you
can you know um so I think it’s some of that and and you know um you know
there’s just there’s just a better way it’s just you got sometimes you got to ask for help
okay such a good story I mean I’ve got to play with Grammy Award winning artists I get to be
in bands with people I looked into and it’s like I I remember sitting in a prison cell in Wasco State
Prison and asking God to find me a job where I can make music and for me at
the time it was having the record deal and being a rock star and I still get to do a little bit of that kind of stuff
but honestly like the the music I get to do with with Air Force Wounded Warriors
is it’s the most rewarding thing I’ve ever got to do because I’m just like
a low bottom Indigent ex-convict tweaker from Anaheim
and I get to fly to Washington DC and be on the Air Force Pace with people that have given their whole lives for this
country and get to work with them and their and and them just trying to get back into life and find some sort of
what the new normal is he’s got security clearance I do imagine they double check
me every time they’re like he are you sure they gonna let it in are we sure yeah but you know I it’s
it’s if I would you know if I would have told you like 16 years ago I’d be doing
what I get to do today with the rad people I get to do it with like I would have told you you were crazy you know so
and it’s all because of what the program has done in my life you know it’s funny
because God answers your prayers but not in the way that you feel think it’s always got his little twist on it but it
is an answered prayer yeah um was there a moment like a defining moment where
you thought maybe I got I got it this time as far as like sobriety or getting
a handle on things in your life where you kind of let that fear of maybe
relapse or going back to your old life drop a little bit and you’re like I think I think I get to keep it this time
yeah I mean I you know even in 16 years in sobriety it hasn’t been perfect you know but I got to listen to what um like
my sponsor and and and I’ve got a good support group of people around me I got some solid guys that I can call if I’m
tripping um my sponsor you know I I’ve been in this time in
sobriety I’ve been stressed out and um not being able to pay bills and I’ve
been at the connect ready to pick up so I could start moving some weight just so I could pay child support and I could
pay for DUI classes and I could do stuff and I’ve been I’ve had the pipe in my hand and watching it crack back and I’ve
had a girl that was dying of cancer that I’ve known for 25 years that knew I was solid saying here I’ll just give you three pounds it’s yours I won’t make it
through the I’m not going to make it through the year you can have it and my sponsor told me like hey if you want to
get high and you want to do something sit on your hands and wait till tomorrow
and that’s said that right before I put it the pipe in my mouth you know and so I did I waited till tomorrow
because I couldn’t get a stable job and do whatever and I swear to God the next morning I get a call from Costa Mesa
moving company saying hey I got a full-time position for you driving I can guarantee you this amount of hours this
is how much money you’re going to make blah blah blah blah blah we love the work that you’ve been doing here can you
show up now if I would have taken that hit you’d been gone gone
done you know and um that ended up I’ve been at that company basic you know I
branched out here back and forth but I’ve been it’s been a solid place for me for 13 years until I started doing Rock
recovery and started working with mental health and addiction and um and and being able to play music for a living
but it’s like I’ve had that I’ve been tripping over a girl ready to say screw it and had shots lined up at the bar in
this time in recovery and before I take the shot I call my buddy hey bro I’m about to drink right now and you have
somebody solid enough to be like hey dude give me 15 minutes I’ll be down there and if it’s that bad I’ll drink
with you I remember one time you told me it’s when you want to and you don’t that
that’s when the miracle happens mhm and I thought that was so powerful and that’s exactly what it’s been in my life
it’s like you you you know whether you believe in God and the devil or you don’t or what you know it is it’s just
like whatever evil isn’t in the world they’ll always throw you an easy one over the plate you know here’s your
Escape you want to hit it out of the park and it’s like the times that you don’t for
me it’s like no I don’t need the easy way out this time you know and then the
I there’s always some beautiful gift on the other side and that’s that served served me pretty well up until now do
you have any uh favorite stories about how music has affected somebody’s mental
health yeah I mean I got a ton of them
I got a ton of them like I can like just last
Tuesday last Tuesday I work in Palm Springs right and I show up and I do a
late night session there and it was a bad day at the treatment
center everybody is hating life there one girl’s bestie left
another dude AMA jumped out of the middle of a van in the middle of an intersection and left no everybody’s
Young and IT staff everybody’s and as soon as I show up there staff at the rehabs good luck you
know and there’s one one of my clients is in there talking about like she doesn’t like her roommate and she
doesn’t feel comfortable blah blah blah blah blah I was like and she’s got a beautiful voice I’ve jammed with her this is the second time she’s been back
and I was like hey why don’t you come in and sing with me and she’s like I’m not feeling it today I’m like that’s fine if
you’re not feeling it today well just come in and down hang out you know whatever and so I go set up my stuff
everybody comes in everybody’s joury nobody wants to be part of it we do our check-ins we do all the clinical stuff and we’re sitting around and we’re doing
everything and I was like okay so what what’s the deal what kind of song We well we want if we do anything we want
to do something uplifting okay so we’re like well what are we going to write about I don’t know and she’s like I
don’t want to write about anything today sucks I was like okay we’ll write a song Today sucks yep what kind of song we
want to do we want to do something like happy so we we start doing some like Reay Sublime type stuff everybody comes
there’s like five of us when we start and the and the girl starts singing [ __ ] today you know what I mean yep it’s
really really hard [ __ ] today and so then next thing you know I got 30 of these people coming out of their rooms
and they’re all coming in there everybody’s shaking something and dancing around and trying to add stuff and we just wrote These lyrics about I
talk to my baby daddy and he’s not as good as a 73 caddy and like blah blah blah blah blah and he sucks so bad and
it was just like you know being on the last day of my paper on my day has a pan and all these things like we started
like just talking about like okay what what sucked for you today what sucked for you today what sucked for you today
and we wrote the song about how today just [ __ ] sucks and then everybody just everybody left there with a smile
on their face you know that’s what that’s the power of music like I got chills like my me too you know so that I
mean I and I’ve I get to experience that daily you know what I mean and it’s not
it’s not always that but it was like that was one of the radest groups I’ve ever got got to do you know all from a
bad day yeah or then it’s like with Wounded Warriors where I we get a week to work with them it’s not just one like
two hour session so we get to actually flush out the song we start it and then like the second day we’ll try to do some
finishing touches on it third day we’ll finish it and then maybe start a new one and work throughout throughout the week
but it’s like you see people that come in there and they’re just emotionally broken and bankrupt and
they’ve dedicated their lives to something bigger like the country and then sometimes they get failed by the
country and sometimes they get failed by the service and sometimes they get failed you know and and whether they’re
sick or whether they got injured in battle or whether they’re not but they don’t know what to do with their lives anymore because that was their
life and um you know sometimes it’s like you people that have seen terrible
terrible things just be able to open up and have joy again when they haven’t had joy in 15 years they haven’t smiled in
15 years years and you get the first smile out of them for forever you know I I get those I get to and then it’s it’s
so much bigger than me from where that I come from and then with people that I look up to just because they had that
much you know conviction and perseverance to do
something bigger than themselves than just be pour it into meth and things
that I didn’t you know yeah exactly well I just want to thank you
for being here today yeah that was awesome we’ve never had anything like
that I got chills a couple times me too yeah cool thanks for having me thanks for asking me to come down I really
appreciate it yeah thank you yeah thank you
